Hallo.

I hab eine zerlegte TR1 die Ich zu gutem Preis auf ebay ergattert habe. War als 1997er 1100 gelisted, ist aber definitiv eine Trine.

Motorenbau Erfahrung hab ich leider noch keine aber einen selbstgebauten XV750SE cafe racer hab Ich auch. Ich arbeite als TIG Schweisser und Zugriff auf eine Drehbank und Fräse hab ich auch. Also doch nicht ganz ohne technisches Können, nur Motoren hab ich noch nicht gemacht..

Beim Abholen sagte der Verkäufer etwas über den vorherigen Besitzer, der hatt das Ding anscheinend beim Brighton Speed Trials gesprinted..

Also dann beim Auspacken sind mir einge Sachen aufgefallen die nicht so aussehen wie was Ich hier so auf den Fotos finde. Ich mach gern noch mehr Fotos wenn das hilft..

Erstmal dann, Zylinderköpfe, meine sehn da mal ganz anders aus.. mit grösseren Kühlrippen..?

Kolben, sehn aus als hätten die unter schlechter Lagerung gelitten.. die 'Schürze am unteren Rand' (entschuldigt mein Deutsch, Deutsch ist meine 2te Sprache, Ich spreche 4 und mir fehlt es bei meisten an den genauen technischen Ausdrücken)

Zylinder steht 980cc drauf.

Verbesserten Starter hat se schon, oder hatten den die Trinen sowieso?

Weber Doppelvergaser, weis gar nicht wo Ich da soll anfangen..

Fahrgestell Modifikationen sind ok, 17 Zoll Räder von einer Suzuki, hintere Scheibenbremse, Fussratenhänger komm ich mit klar

Auspuffanlage, 2 in 2 offenes Rohr, nicht in Edelstahl aber fein gemacht..

So jetzt die Fotos:

Guess you don't mind me answering in English, do you?

The TR1 always sported the uprated starter, the heads look fairly stock to me (except for the grooves milled into the fins). You'd have to CC them to find out, which volume they are.

From my old notes:

XV750 head volume: 47cc
TR1 head volume: 55cc
XV1100 head volume: 67cc

Maybe you'd like to take a closeup photo of the valves as an XV750 head would sport smaller valves than a TR1 or XV1100 head.
The pistons look fairly stock to me as do the barrels, so it's unlikely it's running either one of the more common 1100cc conversions.

The Weber carb could either be a homegrown bodge-job or it could be a setup going back to Ed Burdell (check out the old AWOL-mags). That said, I am almost dieing to see the chassis and bits...

Cheers,
Greg

Kolben original, vielleicht "feingewuchtet" - Schrott
Köpfe serienmäßig mit gebohrten Kühlrippen, so wies aussieht
Erst mal das Gehäuse kontrollieren, ob linkes Hauptlager nicht mitgedreht hat!
Sieht nach richtig viel Arbeit aus.
S.

Hi Greg, been reading quite a few of your posts here and on vtech and your blog, you do some fun work! and no I don't mind the English answer :).

The bike came with no bodywork, the Webers could be a home bodge as you say, I found only one TR1 listed in the Brighton Speed trials and that was in 1998.. :-? No times or anything though :-/

I'll post a pic of the wheels and such as I have and have to see about the head pic for valve size comparison..

I do have an Idea of where I'd like to go for the look of the bike though.. but that can always change.

Cheers,

Rant.

Danke Sepp.

Ich glaub Ich bin dafür hier in guten Händen. Wenn du sagst 'Gehäuse kontrolliern, ob linkes Hauptlager nicht mitgedreht hat!' meinst du das Zylinderkopfgehäuse?

Denkst du die Kolben sind noch Originalmaß? Was müsste Ich denn da reinsetzen, es soll ja nur eine leichte Straßenmaschiene werden..

Die Zylinderbohrungen fülen sich noch schön glatt an bis auf 2-3 kleine Korrosionsflecken aber keine Rillen oder Dellen.

Wie gesagt, Mechanikererfahrung hab ich keine aber lernen will ichs schon!  :)

Ayeup Mr. Smith,

cheers for the roses.

Ich übersetz' das einfach mal für den Sepp.

What Sepp meant was to check, whether the left main-bearing has spun in the cases and thereby wrecking said cases. One of the nasty things about TR1s is, there's hardly any oversize pistons available, so you may be forced to get another set of barrels with better pistons.

A standard mod for more oomph would be to go for 750 heads to raise the compression a litte.

Would you care to share some pix of the Webers and the manifold they came with?
Oh and take a photo of the left crank bearing seat to check, whether it is dead or not.

Cheers,
Greg

Ich glaube, Sepp meint das linke Kurbelwellen- Hauptlager, main crankshaft bearing, dazu muss der Motorblock zerlegt werden. Das Lager dreht gerne im Stahlring - Steel sleeve- mit. Vorsicht mit den Hauplagern, das sind keine Norm-Lager, also sehr teuer, wenn die neu müssen.
Ich hatte mir vor vielen Jahren das Haynes-Manual für die XV-Modelle gekauft, das ist erstmal ganz hilfreich, auch wenn viel Blödsinn drin steht.
So wie es aussieht, wirst du wohl das Puzzle zerlegen und kontrollieren müssen,  
Gruß Ali
Der Greg war fixer :o

Thanks Greg, I wish I was closer to both yours and Sepps workshops or had more money then I could get either/both of you to do up the engine.. but then if I had more money I would have bought a running TR1..  ::)

Here's a pic of the Webers and manifold, will get in the workshop in a bit and take a pic of the bearing, as far as I remember all the bearings were still in place in the cases though.

As for pistons, I seem to remember reading bits about sr500/xt500 pistons..?

Cheers,

Rant.

rantingsmith wrote:

As for pistons, I seem to remember reading bits about sr500/xt500 pistons..?

FWIW, an XT600 piston is pretty close to an XV1100 piston (but they sport a different compression height to fit into the same cases even though they added several millimetres to the stroke). That said, one would have to check and do a classic suck 'n' see approach to find out how close they are. (But I doubt it, otherwise Mr. Sepp would be doing this already.) I do have some SR500 pistons in my workshop and at least one knackered TR1-piston, so I shall check it for you. But truth be told, I wouldn't hold my breath...

Cheers,
Greg

Auf dem Kolbenboden ist entweder nix, .25 oder .50 eingestanzt.
Nix ist Original.
S.

Cool, danke Greg, Sepp und Ali.

Hab grad mal mehr und bessere Fotos gemacht kann die aber nicht gross genug hier raufladen daß man sich die Sache da gutt genug ansehen kann.

Hier ist ein Link zu einem Flickr album, die Sache ist privat ausser du benutzt diesen Link: https://www.flickr.com/gp/acciarini/0D7A5Q

Hier findest du Fotos in größerer Auflösung.

Cheers,

Rant

As the crank is still in the cases, one can't say much. (It's a good sign though, because normally people c*ck up the bearing set by pressing out the crank without pre-heating the cases...)

With regards to the pistons, you may want to drop Sepp a message asking for a set of barrels 'n' matching pistons cause I got nought left.
(Sorry)

XV920 cylinders and pistons would fit on the block straight away, so you might be lucky with a set of those...

Cheers,
Greg

Thanks Greg.

I did turn the crank and everything seems quite solid, no play as such and no heat discoloration around the bearing race or case aluminium, I wiped the oil residue out of the bottom of the case halves and nothing gritty in there.

The guy I bought it from was the brother of the guy who bought it from the guy who had supposedly drag raced it at the Brighton Speed trials, looking at the archive info on the entrants there seems to only ever have been 1 TR1 raced there and only once.. my guess is the buy built it, raced it and lost then got himself a different machine for the following year.. the engine does not seem to have suffered from catastrophic failure and the brother said it was running before it was taken apart to be fitted with bigger pistons.. possibly the 1100 conversion..

As for my 'knackered pistons' (and here my lack of experience with mechanics will show) could the broken bits of skirt not simply be turned down? A lot of pistons seem to be of shorter overall height as far as I can make out..?

Then back to the many trodden path of 'are there no other pistons that can be used? What is the specs of them, diameter and gudgeon pin dia and height? I really don't have a spare £300 or so at the moment to buy a set from halfway across the World and then pay another 25% vat and import handling on top.

I will find out if Sepp has any and at what price but I already know the project is going to take quite a while so no harm exploring all possible avenues.


Cheers,

Rant
Cheers

Hi Rant,

the thing with the 1100 conversion is, the bore is the same, you just fit a longer stroke crank. A stroker kit, if you want to employ this Americanism...
The thing with just turning down the piston skirts is that they are (most likely) deformed due to the impact they have suffered.

Talking of which, I may have a set of pistons in (currently) unknown quality. I'll have a look at them tomorrow, when I am back in my workshop. Please drop me a PM, if I forget to message you until the evening.

Cheers,
Greg

nanno wrote:

The thing with just turning down the piston skirts is that they are (most likely) deformed due to the impact they have suffered.

Looking closely at the break area makes me think the skirts got knocked when the boxes of parts were moved around as they were just lying loosely in one of the boxes. I can chuck them on the lathe at work and check them, if the skirts play no essential roles in the running of the whole then I have nothing to loose by turning these down..?


nanno wrote:

Talking of which, I may have a set of pistons in (currently) unknown quality. I'll have a look at them tomorrow, when I am back in my workshop. Please drop me a PM, if I forget to message you until the evening. Cheers, Greg

That would be very cool, otherwise I'll have to look at going the stroker way. Correct me if I am wrong but longer stroke usually means more torque whereas a shorter stroke means the engine revs up easier..?

Cheers,

Rant.

rantingsmith wrote:

Looking closely at the break area makes me think the skirts got knocked when the boxes of parts were moved around as they were just lying loosely in one of the boxes. I can chuck them on the lathe at work and check them, if the skirts play no essential roles in the running of the whole then I have nothing to loose by turning these down..? That would be very cool, otherwise I'll have to look at going the stroker way. Correct me if I am wrong but longer stroke usually means more torque whereas a shorter stroke means the engine revs up easier..?

It's not THAT easy. The piston skirts limit the longitudinal tilt of the pistons. The shorter the skirt, the bigger the load on the cylinder walls.
As a matter of fact, yes it means more torque, especially also because the 1100 crank is heavier. Still with the correct carbs and a bit of ignition tweaking my 1100 with the heavy crank revs A LOT FASTER than a stock engine. Especially since I fitted 750 heads to bump the compression ratios into the low 10s.

Cheers,
Greg

I habe heute die Kurbelwelle mal gegen die von einer XVS1100 ausgetauscht. Der Stahlring vom linken Gehäuse sieht für mich noch ok aus aber Spezialist bin ich ja nicht, wie sieht dan so einer aus wenn er futsch ist?

Servus,

Rant.